Looking back on ‘Donald Trump’s train-crash interview’

Jonathan Swan: I had no idea my face was making those weird shapes.

Fitz: Oh, come on. Just between us – it will go no further than The Sun-Herald readership – you must have known at the time your facial expressions would go viral, so were you being a teeny bit theatrical?

Jonathan Swan: I promise you I didn’t. I only realised afterwards what a ham I was.

Fitz: You also kept interrupting him, trying to get him to answer the question. We have all seen Trump bite the heads off reporters that “don’t respect the office”, and yet he didn’t seem to mind. Did that surprise you?

Jonathan Swan: I didn’t think of it that way. I tried to listen and react naturally … which preparation allows.

Fitz: Last time we chatted, you mentioned Trump had no clue what the impact of the interview would be. What did he say to you, after you wrapped it up?

Jonathan Swan: After the interview ended the president’s only request was that we not edit him too much because he wanted the “sentences to flow”. He also predicted it would get “great ratings”. He was right on both counts.

Fitz: After the interview went viral, and became known as “Trump’s train-crash interview”, did you take heat from trolls, “fake news!” etc?

Jonathan Swan: Uh yeah … my inbox was a sewer for quite a while.

Fitz: Last time I saw you in the flesh, was in Washington for Joe Hockey’s farewell as US ambassador. But we kept getting interrupted by DC heavyweights and media titans wanting to get in your ear. It was like a scene out of the West Wing. Do you ever pinch yourself?

Jonathan Swan: My recollection was we were on our own in the corner getting ignored by everyone. But if that’s what you remember, I won’t disabuse you.

(He’s being modest. It was a heavyweight gathering, and of the assembled media, though he wasn’t regarded as Muhammad Ali – the NYT’s Maureen Dowd was – he was at least Joe Frazier.)

Fitz: Do you still talk to Trump?

Jonathan Swan: We didn’t talk again during his presidency, but I have talked to him a couple of times this year when I’ve reached out for comment on stories.

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Fitz: How deep is the fear that Biden is just a blip and America will return to a Trumpian Republican leadership sooner than we think?

Jonathan Swan: Among Democrats and quite a few establishment Republicans the fear is real and very rational. Anybody who dismisses Trump’s political future as a potential GOP 2024 nominee is reading different polls than I am.

Fitz: Do you think when you hit 50 in a decade and a bitty, you will most likely be in DC? Do you ever think you might move back to Sydney, or have you outgrown us, you sniffy bastard! Never forget, we at the Herald made you, and we can BREAK you!

Jonathan Swan: My dream is to come back to co-host [the ABC coronavirus podcast] Coronacast … a Weekend at Normy’s situation.

Fitz: Go well, and thank you. (But we still knew you when you were…